Oculus Experimental Setups Feature Smaller Tracked Area Than HTC Vive

by Ian Hamilton • November 30th, 2016

The question we’ve been unable to answer all year with Oculus shipping Touch so late in 2016 is one step closer to being answered. Which headset offers a better room-scale experience, the HTC Vive or Oculus Rift?

We still can’t fully answer that question yet, but two guides posted to the Oculus support page show experimental 360-degree and room-scale sensor setups that are smaller than the maximum size of an HTC Vive tracked room.

Here are three screenshots from the three publicly available users guides for comparison:

HTC Vive 2 Base Stations

vive-stations

The HTC Vive user guide also notes “movement within a diagonal area of up to 5 m (16 ft 4 in) is supported. For example, a 3.5 m x 3.5 m (around 11 ft 5 in x 11 ft 5 in) space. For room-scale setup, a minimum play area of 2 m x 1.5 m (6 ft 6 in x 5 ft) is required.”

Oculus Rift 2 Sensors, 360 Experimental Setup

oculus-2-sensor-360

Oculus Rift 3 Sensors, Room-Scale Experimental Setup

oculus-3-sensor

The Oculus 3-sensor guide notes “you’ll be able to experience 360° tracking in a play area that you’ll map out, which can be up to 8×8 feet (2.5 x 2.5 meters).”

It is also worth noting this chart from June showing the breakdown of the size of VR setups using Steam. It shows 20 percent of users with setups measuring larger than the maximum outlined by Oculus in these two guides.

This suggests that even if you invest in a third sensor for your Oculus Rift, totaling to roughly $880 in VR-specific hardware, and use the “experimental” room-scale setup as recommended by Oculus, you’re still setting up a smaller play space than can be supported by an HTC Vive.

All of this doesn’t mean you necessarily get a lesser experience with a Rift, but it is some of the most detailed information we’ve seen yet for comparing the capabilities of the Vive and Rift. The Vive is $800 and features only two base stations you place at opposite ends of the room for a play area that can be around a meter larger in either direction.

  • Paulo

    What a headline.

    Is anybody surprised ? The rift has a shorter cable and while fully capable of roomscale this was obvious. If you want the maximum play space possible then an HTC vive is your best bet.

    Most consumers don’t have that much free space. It’s not something I care about personally. Super stoked for motion controllers and 360 tracking so the play space oculus gives me is more than enough.

    • Thor

      Frankly, when you do get roomscale, you always want more space. I rigged up my TV so I could move it out of my living room without having to unhook anything, just so I could add a couple more feet onto one side of my play space….and eliminate the possibility that I would hit my TV while playing with my Vive. These tighter constraints just mean more people will be smashing into things when they get Oculus in roomscale.

      • RationalThought

        Hopefully the Chaperone like system they have will work well. Haven’t heard much about that and it’s pretty important when introducing room scale.

      • jlschmugge

        Tighter constants? Rift or Vive, if you play in the same room with either you are at the same risk of hitting the same stuff. The Rift would actually be less risk since it limits your play area in the same space, effectively forcing a buffer.

        I’m with @Paulo on available space. I just don’t care to give up the space with either headset. That’s fine and dandy if it’s worth the trouble for you to keep moving your tv. I have my Rift PC hooked up to the cheapest 19 inch tv in the house. All the room I have only lets me take a step forward and backwards.

    • GroovyMonster

      “What a headline.”

      Well, that’s uploadvr for you. They will never give up the fight, I guess. lol

      • Malkmus

        I don’t get it. What is so interesting about the headline?

        • Trooper

          It is designed to invoke an argument between Vive and rift owners, or more commonly known as click bait.

          • Get Schwifty!

            This is true at RoadToVR as well…. they let good old “Drive-Bye” Kent give his anti-Oculus drivel every time there is a spat of press on Oculus and the Vive fan-set laps it up. What do you really expect from sites that make money off of advertising?

  • Doctor Bambi

    This article inadvertently confirmed that two Oculus cameras set up in opposite corners will perfectly fit my play space, which makes me super happy. 🙂

    The lighthouse tracking system is a thing of beauty though and is clearly setting an industry standard on tracking volume, but that is only one of many factors to consider when choosing a headset.

    • John Nemesh

      Unless you already own a Rift, the other “factors” you mention are insignificant. You buy a Vive, and you get the best tracking, the best headset, and the most games. It really is as simple as that.

      • Lukimator

        Lol, nice trolling bro. We can swap best headset for “most uncomfortable” and games for “demos” and then it would be true

      • Paulo

        Its been said pretty much everywhere that the vive was better because of motion controllers. That big advantage is out the window. Vive is an inferior HMD in more ways than one. Its about pros and cons. The rift HMD had more pros, and now with touch it has even more. Both are great VR systems and do what they do well, but one is CLEARLY better than the other at this point.

        • Max Cheung

          you have to consider oculus is owned by facebook. so nope, I am getting a vive instead

        • “Vive is an inferior HMD in more ways than one” Having spent a considerable amount of time in the 3 Rifts (dk1, dk2, cv1) and 2 Vives (dk and retail) I own, I don’t see a way to justify this statement. Mind clarifying?

          • Paulo

            In case you’re serious: Image clarity, bigger sweet spot, lighter and better balanced (less front heavy). Built in audio removes some hassle of putting it on/off. Its just better designed.

            The Vive has a bit of a fov increase at the expense of more sde and less god rays. I bought a Rift knowing all its pros and cons and I have not been disappointed.

          • Ferret Bomb

            I’ve tried both; image clarity is comparable. Rift has *slightly* less SDE. Vive has a noticeably brighter display, which made a few games more vibrant. Lighter/balanced are the same point, but fair enough. I wear glasses, and the Rift was considerably harder to fit properly as a result as compared to the Vive, and resulted in a significant reduction in FOV. Sweet spot seemed about the same too. Definitely more godrays on the Vive. Touch seemed noticeably less accurate and more ‘floaty’ than the Vive sticks, though that may have been due to the setup they were using (it was in a fairly bright area). Pretty sure most people will write off the built-in headphones as they were… pretty bad. Didn’t shut out any noise at all, absolutely terrible for immersion.

            With all of those points, as I have a large area I can use for roomscale, and disagree strongly with Facebook’s policies and business practices, I’ll probably go for the Vive when it comes time. Plus there’s the wireless option coming out for the Vive in a month or two, which is kind of a ‘holy grail’ point if you don’t want to be dragging a cable or lugging a backpack-computer.

          • Buddydudeguy

            More floaty, less accurate? anecdotal nonsense that could be attributed to just about anything. Tracking should be just as good. The built in headphones are FANTASTIC. I love how you dont even have either a Vive or a RIft yet you think you know better. Keep reading bud, you got more research to do. Wrong on all counts.

          • Ferret Bomb

            Yes, I thought I’d made it clear that I was recounting my experiences from actually going hands-on with both, and pointed out a potential reason for the issue in the same breath. But cards-down, when I tried them, the Touch controllers did not track as well.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Must have been a bad demo. Not set up properly, who knows.

          • Trooper

            jesus christ, give it a rest m8, every vive vs rift story you always go on about how the rift is superior but you cant prove it properly as all you can use is your opinion, which according to you, is right and everyone elses’ is wrong, you are a boring individual who keeps piping the same tune over and over and over. You say that anyone who enjoyed the Vive over the rift must have had a “bad demo” This argument is no different to the Xbox vs PS , Manchester United vs Liverpool FC.

            Why is it so important to you for other people to love a toy that you own ?? And why are they so wrong when they don’t ? It is all down to personal tastes and incase you haven’t noticed people tend to be individuals who like different things, that does not make them right or wrong, just different. You need to chill and respect the fact that not everyone is going to prefer the Rift over the Vive, it’s called personal choice.

          • Buddydudeguy

            I NEVER “go on about how the Rift is superior”. I state facts and correct people who spread misinfo. Take a big breath. holy crap haha

          • Trooper

            see you are at it again, even after having had your serious problem pointed out to you you still continue. Either get behind all of the tech or say nothing at all as constant bitching will only equal a failure as an entire platform.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Learn to read.

          • Trooper

            Holy shit I actually thought that you had taken on some advice, but no you are back to your usual self. Please don’t bother commenting on this anymore as I really don’t want to talk to a self obsessed fanboy who has the empathetic ability of a dead toad.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Holy shit you’re still a retard. Let me save both of us trouble. You’re muted. So obnoxious.

          • Trooper

            lmao you call me obnoxious yet you are the rabid Rift fanboy……Get a life, idiot.

          • Brian Green

            Way to jump down the dudes throat for having g an opinion…Jesus Christ…..sounds like someone is trying desperately to justify buying something and is regretting it and will do anything to convince himself that he made the right choice.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Not sure if serious. Buyers remorse? You’re kinda…stupid, ya? I love my Rift 🙂 try again. Just correcting mis info.

          • Carl Wolsey

            Given that the two tracking systems are completely different I don’t know why you would assume they both perform equally. Vives tracking system has already proven itself perfectly capable, it was built for room scale from the start – can’t say the same about Rifts, it was built for a seated experience and now they’ve tried to stretch it to work at room scale. “Must have been a bad demo. Not set up properly, who knows.” – keep telling yourself that.

          • Buddydudeguy

            What do you mean can’t say the same about Rifts? There are numerous videos and reviews. Have been for weeks. Stopped reading at ” built for seated experiences” gtfo.

          • alboradasa

            Yeah Ferret, how dare you contribute your experiences to this discussion. Your experience was WRONG

          • Buddydudeguy

            Well? It’s true. He’s just spreading mis info.

          • Ferret Bomb

            Uh… no. I’m “spreading” the experience I had, actually trying it hands-on. If anything, you telling me that my first-hand experience is ‘wrong’ somehow would be misinformation, damage control, spin, apologism, or just outright delusion.

            It doesn’t become “misinformation” just because it doesn’t agree with your personal narrative.

          • EU Ropa

            I have oculus touch and I have all the requirements, but the tracking is very poor, there’s a lot of jittering and hand drifting going on a lot. I’m so sorry I didn’t get the vive.

          • Buddydudeguy

            That’s you, with a issue to sort out. Lots of people arent having your issue. You should be trouble shooting not pointing blame.

          • EU Ropa

            You don’t understand the problem. Nobody should have any issues with the Oculus experience, because it is a premium product and should work well, and many people are having my problem. The sensors are average quality, and not premium as they should be.

          • Buddydudeguy

            “Nobody should have any issues with the Oculus experience”…ahh, so the user isn’t responsible for setting it up correctly? How do you define ” premium quality”? What do you say about those who don’t have your issue?

          • Kraufthauser

            I own both the Vive and the Rift. I find he Rift the beter hmd. Vive is great toon tho.

          • GodMk2

            I own 4x Vive and 2x Rift; 1 PS VR and 2 X Gear VR. Vive is better than Rift, but Rift is still awesome. PS VR… hmmmmn. Gear VR is cheap but great for younger kids who dont get chaperone bounds mean they cant run any further. Sit them in a chair watching fish. 😉
            Who cares whats better if its good at what it does fir the price. PS VR isnt as good as PC VR but its a lot cheaper and suited to teenager bedrooms.

          • Ferret Bomb

            Yeah, I’d tried out PSVR at the same time. If the Touch tracking was floaty, the PSVR’s tracking was poop on toast. But the lack of SDE is huge. Not an option though, as I know I’ll want roomscale when I pick one up.

          • Doctor Bambi

            The headphones seem to be very polarizing for people. For those of us who love them, the ease of use is a no-brainer, and I like being able to hear what’s going on around me in the real world if someone needs to get my attention. With them positioned correctly on my ear and at the right volume level, I found them to provide a very immersive audio experience.

            But I get that noise isolation is a big deal for a lot of people. Sounds like the Vive was the best choice for you.

          • Ferret Bomb

            I’m leaning that way more and more at this point, and the super-aggressive Oculus fanboys telling me that my experiences were wrong/”misinformation” aren’t helping.

            But yes, hearing the outside world kind of ripped me out of the experience.

          • EU Ropa

            I have touch controllers and they are poor quality. A lot of jittering and drifting happening.

          • Burstup

            The built-in headphones of the Rift sound amazing.

          • I definitely didn’t mean to start yet another pointless, Internet, holy-war :/

            Contrary to what you and others below seem to think, I asked a question, I didn’t make some fan-boy loaded comment.

            I was serious. I’m quite aware of difference in the two, but that’s exactly why I asked for clarification. Your response makes me wonder if we’re talking about the same hardware because for one, the Vive has had built-in audio since the dev kit I got from Valve 2 years ago though it didn’t include it’s own speakers until the current retail I think (which came with multiple audio options, including built-in mic and provided ear-buds).

            For the sake of discussion, I will agree that the sweet spot is MUCH smaller on the retail vive than it was on the devkit or is on the CV1. In fact, that’s the one thing I hold against the Vive because it’s so small that I find myself having to “look” much more to see things clearly.

            For weight, I’ll give it to the CV1, but I don’t find the Vive to be heavy enough to be an issue so in reality that point is kind of a wash for me personally. I CAN see how it could be more significant to someone with a smaller head or weaker neck though.

            I find the light-houses to be a far superior solution for many reasons and tracking volume actually isn’t one given my space. I can support multiple HMDs (something that’s frequently useful at conferences such as SVVR, OC3, VRDays; all of which I’ve attended recently). Also, no connection to a PC is needed which means I have FAR more freedom to place the lighthouses where I want, without concerns for cable runs or length

            As for audio, I got the new earbuds for the CV1 at OC3 and they are quite nice, but I was still left wanting to use one of my own solutions such as my Shure’s, Sennheisers or even my Zik’s and that’s only possible with the Vive right now.

            Perhaps most important to me though, is the lack of USB port on the CV1 compared to the vive. The USB port on the vive has many values, the least of which is not the Leap Motion. Touch and Vive controllers are great for most experiences, but both are both hacks compared to the ultimate solution which is having your own hands in VR and the Leap is the best solution on that front so far. With the CV1, I have to run another cable from my PC, which largely washes out the benefit of that otherwise amazing single cable where with the Vive, I can use the port on the HMD and it works beautifully.

            The longer cable on the Vive is another advantage. Some mention it in the context of tracking volume, but for me it’s more about cable-management. The longer the cable, the better I can manage it to keep it out from under my feet. I’ve attached a photo of my solution for my office. I can’t do this with the CV1 which is why I haven’t use the carabiner’s I purchased (but will when my Fove arrives).

            Another issue (and perhaps the largest) I have with the CV1 isn’t so much about the HMD, but the platform as a whole. Oculus Home… I know their motivation so I can’t fault them, but the fact is that I’ve had 2 significant periods of downtime with the CV1 and both came down to software and lack of support. Having fought my way through the DK1, DK2 and now CV1; I can say authoritatively that the Oculus software stack is lacking and not well thought out. This goes for GearVR as well. I’m a developer with apps on iTunes, Play Store, Oculus Home and Steam (though nothing public on Steam). Both the development experience and end-user experience on Steam has been far better despite the approach Oculus has taken with Home, which SHOULD be far smoother. More importantly, I can play apps on Steam with either HMD in many cases, while home is limited to the CV1. Both as a developer and end-user, Steam takes the lead here by far.

            To sum up my perspective, I have a personal preference for the Vive at this point (despite the annoyingly small sweet spot), but that likely has as much to do with my preferences for use as anything. If I was more concerned with the half-vr games on Oculus now (since Touch is only recently relevant and will still be trailing for some time) and didn’t prefer my own headphones, I’d say the CV1 would be my go-to objectively and subjectively. The reality though is that after a year of using Vive controllers, VR feels incomplete to me if my hands aren’t in the experience. Most of my personal time is now spent in Onward, RecRoom, Eleven Table Tennis and RecRoom so when those are available on Touch, my overall preference may shift. I’m definitely looking forward to Robo Recall so my CV1 will see some use there. I’m glad I have both and I think anyone that makes comments like, “Vive is an inferior HMD in more ways than one” likely do so because they don’t have both or else they too would find it hard to call either superior or “the” winner.

          • Doctor Bambi

            Do you mind clarifying what advantages you found with Vive over Rift besides tracking volume?

          • Just saw this, but I replied above.

          • EU Ropa

            I have touch controllers, they drift and shake a lot in certain places even though I’m right in front of the sensor.

        • Brian

          oh how I love oculus fanboys.. i find it absolutely comical they still defend that garbage company after how they treat you.. face it, the rift is a cheap glued together toy compared to the vive.. how nice those three cameras will look duct taped across your ceiling. we’re all just laughing at you guys now as the score keeps tallying up.

          wait till those touch controllers are released… watch the problems and reports roll in..

          • Kraufthauser

            “he rift is a cheap glued together toy compared to the vive”.

            LOL, you have no idea what you are talking about (I own both). You fanboys are just well…. boys.

          • EU Ropa

            I have oculus touch and the tracking is a joke.

        • goldenegg

          There may be a ‘CLEARLY better’ option for you, but I can’t agree with that in the general case.

          I’ve been using VR at home since the DK1. Later got the DK2 and currently own the GearVR, PSVR, CV1 and Vive. I use both the CV1 and Vive a lot and still couldn’t call a clear winner between either. I also have Touch, so I don’t have the lack of VR controls clouding my judgement. There are positives and negatives for both VR systems. At the end of the day, both are fantastic pieces of hardware and there’s no bad choice in buying one or the other. They’ll both offer a solid VR experience.

          In the end, it’s always going to come down to personal preference.

          • James Andre

            Thanks for the unbiased opinion.

      • Buddydudeguy

        looool. There is no such thing as a “vive” game. Only games which require motion controllers. 6 more days and that issues nullified. The tracking is as good on the RIft and it’s the better head set.

        • Daffster

          I’m a fan off all systems that bring VR to the masses yet you, sir, are a blight on the community and have single handedly turned this whole thread into another pathetic fanboy slagging match. I mean why ffs?

          Every system has its pros and cons, meanwhile me and just about everyone else here recognises that to the point that we’d have one of each if we could. Do us all a favour and instead of bitching about others experiences or input, if you don’t agree from now on just nod knowingly and move the hell on. We’d all thank you for it.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Ya….no. Try again. Again, I’m just correcting misinfo. Not going to even respond to the rest of your hyperbole-wall-of butthurt.

          • Daffster

            Well you seem keen to ‘correct misinfo’ so thanks for not taking the time to reply to the majority of my post. Glad you agree with that. Meanwhile you’re still a troll flaming a pointless fanboy war.

          • Buddydudeguy

            Correcting misinfo* Glad to clear that up for you.

          • Daffster

            Ok, I had to chuckle at that. Thanks for all the clarification 🙂

      • OkinKun

        The vast majority of consumers don’t have more than 8x8ft to devote to VR. Thus they’d never notice the extra space Vive can do. And the actual tracking Accuracy is relatively the same.
        What consumers WILL notice more, is smaller ergonomic controllers, better hand-presence, and finger tracking.

      • Jonny

        No, just no. With the Rift you get access to more games, and pretty much everyone agrees that the headset itself is superior. With the superior Touch controllers coming out, literally the only reason to get a Vive instead would be the better tracking.

        • Carl Wolsey

          Pretty big reason though! How much are the new controllers (which Vive will be getting anyway) worth to you when they don’t track well?

          • GodMk2

            Scary.. im glad I only ordered 1 set but after reading your comment i googled. And yes it seems people who have them arent getting precise tracking. I hope they are still “good enough”. If not… Ive got 4x vives with a spare pair of controllers 😉 Actually.. one issue… one of the vive wands doesnt do right pad anymore. Not too bad… that goes on a camera now for mixed reality tracking 😉

          • Doctor Bambi

            Most of the impressions I’ve heard of Touch have been glowingly positive. If the tracking was really that poor, I don’t think Oculus would bundle a game like Dead and Buried with it, where precise aiming is very important to the gameplay.

          • Get Schwifty!

            Good point.

        • insum snoy

          Its down to preference which controllers are better. Personally I found the touch controllers to be quite uncomfortable. That said it is unlikely that the Touch controllers wont work with Vive (unofficially of course) but the new open handed Vive controllers look like they will be so much better than both Touch and the current Vive controllers.

          • James Andre

            Touch controllers can’t work with vive… not lighthouse. But they do work with steamvr 100% sp oculus users actually have easier access to more games. Vive users can try to use revive.

      • Pistol Pete

        ^ Speaks the truth!

      • most games versus best games. I’d choose the latter any day

      • Doctor Bambi

        -Best Tracking: With three cameras, the Rift is actually better at avoiding occlusion than Vive.
        -Best Headset: The general consensus is that the Rift is better in ergonomics, weight, and ease of use.
        -Most games: Most games isn’t much of a selling point when 90% of the library is shovel ware.

        I’m not saying you made the wrong decision to go with the Vive, but don’t believe for a second that this is an easy choice for anyone. The fact that this debate is so heated just proves how equally capable these headsets are with one another.

        • Rogue_Transfer

          Occlusion of controllers isn’t an issue for the Vive due to the large donut rings projected away from the hands(and being bigger than the hands too). It simply isn’t possible to occlude them with each other – the same isn’t likely true for the Touch.

          There’s also no area where the two Lighthouse sweeps with 120° by 120° can’t see the controllers in – unless you curl over the controllers with your body – but the same would be even more likely for the tightly packed Touch controllers.

          All I’m wishing to point out that from actual experience, the only issue on the Vive for occlusion is due to the lack of sensors on the back of the headset which can cause loss of tracking when looking inwards and down in certain places of the play area. But as far as controller occlusion – the Vive’s don’t suffer from any in use. It doesn’t need more than two, which is pretty fantastic engineering!

        • Kraufthauser

          Nah, it just proves that a lot of people need a reason to justify their purchase, it’s pathetic.
          I thought the whole pc vs console (and xbox vs ps) discussion was lame. Boy, was I wrong 😉

          • Doctor Bambi

            I come here to discuss VR with other VR enthusiasts. I want to hear people’s opinions and experiences. I want to discuss the pros and cons of all emerging technology. Sometimes responses are off the wall, but for the most part, it’s great and more often than not I end up learning something in the process.

            Comments can get heated, but at least people are giving their voice. It’s not pathetic or lame, it takes a lot of courage to present your opinion in an environment like this.

          • Roger Anthony Essig

            Ive been saying at parties in groups of people saying “i wanted for donald trump to win, and I’m so glad he won”. I’ve already been threatened violence from an SJW. When people ask why, i say ‘It’s to seek out people that will hate me.’

    • Pistol Pete

      Oculus never stated a 2 sensor room-scale was impossible. Just that it will have more sensor occlusions.

      • Doctor Bambi

        Right, but I don’t think they had stated specific recommended dimensions of the tracking volume till now. I was mildly concerned before reading this article, but now I’m totally confident 2 senors will work just fine for my setup.

  • Rick L

    I have 4.8m diagonal with my Vive… In the middle of an L shaped room.
    When I play room scale… I often punch/slash/crash through blinds/walls.
    And I think another 1m or more would be good.
    Pretty sure the lighthouses could handle it too.

    When I play normal seated controller stuff my couch is outside the official rectangle…
    Still works perfectly.

    When I play steering wheel stuff.
    I’m at my desk in the adjacent area 1m out again the other way. Still works perfectly.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9c6309d5136bba440bf3516a0af1bd83120d69a87832b71ffaf232bd4ca233e1.png

    • Junt

      Pretty jelly of your windows.

      • Rick L

        Guess I’ve never really appreciated my windows enough!?

        The photo was to show my play area and outside the play area
        that was still working with the lighthouses you can see.

        I can even sit 1 seat over (2m outside) on the couch (purple thing on the left)
        and it still works fine.

    • KimplE

      Install Linux on those windows.
      just joking 🙂

      but in serious note, those windows are very good looking.

  • polysix

    LMAO – this is not a vive fanboy comment but I guarantee you 5feet across or 7 diagnal is not “roomscale”. I had my vive in an 8 x 13 space or just over and even then I’d often feel the limit on the smaller 8 foot dimension, due to reach of arms etc (I punched the wall at one point and had to repair my controller)… anyway, this just proves that oculus are yet again talking BS and all those stupid (as in thick) Oculus fanboys (you know who you are) who have been trying to negate Vive’s pros all this time are about to realise that facebook REALLY DO LIE, over and over and over again. Fools never learn.

    This is basically standing 360 with a bit of run-off area, same as we always assumed was possible (well – 360 with more than 2 cams cos oculus’ tracking sucks). Also Rift really wasn’t built for roaming/room scale – no breakout box, perm-a-ttached cable to HMD = damaged if you tug it.

    Rift needs a redesign, fast, it’s already looking outclassed in everything but looking nice as an object (and even that’s debatable).

    “All of this doesn’t mean you necessarily get a lesser experience with a Rift, ”

    Stop be so PC, yes, that’s EXACTLY what it means. Along with even worse god rays, stupid facebook spyware, late to the party real VR controls, platform exclusive BS, too high software prices, flaky sensors, cloth that wears out on the HMD, red tint, bad blacks, painful fit and the stigma of being on the sheep train along with the other facebook/oculus fanatics who think anyone (like me) who is open to all VR is somehow ‘scum’ have brought this crap on themselves. Same type who buy crapple over and over again cos they were told to.

    Hope Microsoft, valve and others destroy oculus next year unless oculus actually deliver something like the promise they made all those years ago – not a soft cased mild DK upgrade for twice the price!

    • Paulo

      You are one dedicated vive fanboy. Here’s a hint, just because you say you aren’t doesn’t make it not true 😉

    • Jalen Gonel

      You sure sound like a fanboy bro. They BOTH have pros and cons, neither is perfect. But yea, the Rift is worse in every conceivable way if you disregard facts and everyone who bought one is a mindless fanboy.

      • Buddydudeguy

        Worse in every conceivable way? Do you morons read what you type back to your self? The Rift is the better HMD and Touch embarrasses your wands.

        • Jalen Gonel

          It was sarcasm man. His statement was true “if he disregarded all facts”.

          • Buddydudeguy

            woosh. Got it, missed the if you disregard the facts.

    • Buddydudeguy

      Five feet across? & diagonal? Is your read comprehension that bad? the room scale set up for Rift is 13 feet diagonal, 8.2 feet feet across.
      It’s large enough.

      • Leonardo Phillips

        The real difference is that with a Vive if you have a 10.5×10.5ft room you have a 10.5×10.5 ft roomscale, with the Rift if you have a 10.5×10.5 ft room tou have a 8×8 roomscale. Therefore: is the Rift’s roomscale that is more demanding in terms of room size.

      • DoubleD

        Actually, the Vive is capable of doing double of what they put on the box.
        I saw a video from the guys who made Hoover Junkers where they tested the limits of the tracking.
        They were able to go as far as 12m diagonal (about 40ft) since each lighthouse can produce a 6m radius of tracking.
        They were riding around on a scooter with a headset.

        But then the tracking is probably not as good anymore.

        • Buddydudeguy

          The Rift as well is capable of more than what Oculus officially supports. Look at the 360/room scale diagram. we would be led to believe you’re out of tracking range if you step half a foot to the side of a sensor which is stupid. Not sure why you’re replying to me though.

    • Mike

      Oculus Rift is 10-feet diagonal with 2 sensors. That’s a substantial amount of usable space. I have a large 16ft by 12ft room with furniture and even with the current 1 sensor I’m bumping up against furniture boundaries. 2 sensors will be more than enough. In order to make 3 sensors worth while I’d have to remove all the furniture from the room and actually actively use mostly VR apps that consistently make use of a large 8ft by 8ft (13 ft diagonal) space.

      • Ferret Bomb

        Er, might want to re-read. 10 feet diagonal is the setup area, the play area is 5’x5′ on two sensors; 7 feet diagonal.
        Same with the 13 foot diagonal. That’s the setup distance between the furthest cameras. The play area is ~11 feet diagonal for 8.2’x8.2′. I blame the article for listing weird values on the diagonal lines.

        • Mike

          The image is only accurate if we place the sensors on our desk or bookcase, etc. If the sensors are mounted above head height on the wall then the play space extends virtually (:D intended) all the way up to the sensor. Most people who have a room with that much space might as well mount the sensors on the wall/ceiling anyway.

    • Matthew White

      Wow dude, you really have a problem with Oculus. Did they kill your dad? What about all the ways Oculus is superior to Vive? Have you convinced yourself those don’t matter?

      • Lukimator

        Oculus is inferior to Vive in every way. That’s the way fanboys work, specially the ones who say they aren’t.

        Normal people can see that both have their pros an cons, and it’s up to the individual user to try both and decide which one they like better. Maybe in the future there will be a killer $1500 HMD that is undoubtedly the best but today is not that day

        • Paulo

          “Oculus is inferior to vive in every way”
          “Normal people can see that both have their pros an cons”

          Pick one.

          • Lukimator

            Don’t have to pick one. It’s called sarcasm

          • Matthew White

            He was saying that is how fanboys operate.

        • Trooper

          this message needs to get pinned to every Rift vs Vive story. I am so sick of seeing fanboys (from both sides I might add) spouting absolute shite and insulting the people who did not choose their beloved toy. I own a Vive and I am perfectly happy about it. Do I think it is superior to the Rift ? I haven’t a clue as I haven’t tried a rift out with it’s new controllers and their roomscale stuff. Does everyone who owns a Rift need to send it back and get a Vive ? HELL NO, diversity is what will make VR popular, we are the early adopters who should be concentrating on the tech and not causing childish arguments over which is better, we should be promoting it not writing scathing reports on the Headset that we don’t own or don’t like.

    • wheeler

      Look I’m not a fan of Oculus’s/Facebook’s business practices and their hardware exclusivity bullshit either, but you’re really not helping with inflammatory comments like this. No one that purchased a Rift is going to read this and agree with your criticisms when you start calling people “stupid”/”thick” fanboys. Instead, you’re just going to motivate them to defend their decision/positions and perhaps even be more forgiving of Oculus’s/Facebook’s behavior. You’re making this tribal. If you actually care about these things, then be more constructive and also stop being an asshole.

    • Michael Griffin

      The HDMI cable is not permanently attached. It unplugs from the Rift just like the Vive cable comes our the Vive. Also I have used my Rift in a room with a 16 foot diagonal and tracking is perfect. I own both a Rift and a Vive. They are both great and trade blows in a lot of respects. I can honestly say I don’t significantly like one over the other. Some days I think man the Vive is great and others days I think man the Rift is great. But neither has convinced me of an outright winner.

    • OkinKun

      My Rift + Touch room-scale space is roughly 8×10 feet, and it works great. lol So your whole post is silly.

    • Jonny

      “Hey guys, I’m not a vegetarian, but I don’t eat any sort of meat.”

  • Tom Daigon

    When Im playing in room scale …. the more room, the better! So the Vive was the right choice for me.

  • GodMk2

    How about getting 2x Rift in one room? With Vive you stick 2x PC with 2xHMD and then a pair of Lighthouses in the corners. Given the Oculus sticks the USB from the sensors straight into the back of the PC – that means you’ll need 6x sensors to do rooms scale with Rift? What about 4 players? Might not be a problem for most, but if you want to go to a friends to play PvP in the same physical area… it’s a problem for the future. Or VRcade owners like me. Vive apparently can track as many HMD and controllers as you can fit in a room.. the light houses just emit X-Y lasers with a timing pulse, and the individual HMD/PC combo works out where it and it’s controllers are. Room size is only limited by light levels.. 5m is just a known working size for HTC to quote, but I’ve seen one group of youtubers hitting something over 10m in HoverJunkers in their studio space. I’ve got 2 Rifts and 4xVive so not a fan boy either way, but if you want to play jumping around and spacious VR games – there’s only 1 way I’d bother with. Keep Rift for seated/standing only stuff and stop worrying about roomscale – it wasn’t designed for it. Plenty of games are based on standing in 1 place. The rift with 1 sensor can do a bit of side stepping tracking etc so it’s not game over. Just limited.

    • Doctor Bambi

      It’s an interesting point, you’d just want to be careful about occlusion issues at that point as the base stations still need line of sight to the headset and wands. Not to mention, you get two people flailing around close to each other and there’s bound to be some collisions that could really hurt. Neither the Rift nor the Vive are really designed to handle situation.

      And if you are setting up a VR arcade, I don’t see why Rift wouldn’t be a nice choice with just the two front facing setup. Games like Dead and Buried are sure to be a blast. And having the sensors connect to the PC means less power outlets to worry about. Also, a smaller play space might be ideal to maximize the number of booths available.

      • Daniel Lucid

        Its easy setting up two individual chaperones when using 2x Vives in the same lighthouse-space. 🙂
        So that scenario is actually handled very well with the Vive.

        It might not be ideal for very intense titles where you have a danger to go into the other persons area regardless of the chaperone, but it works wonderfully nonetheless.

        Just sayin’ 😉

      • GodMk2

        I do have 2x Rift exctly for that reason. Seated and standing. And the Vives have their own space but in the same room. Im yet to find a game that allows the chaperones to be crossed in space but shows an avatar to avoid collissions Players need to be constrained with no teleporting or locomotion for that to work! So an escape room style game would work. Or at least something set in a room.

        • Doctor Bambi

          Gotcha, sounds like you’ve done your homework and sounds like a really cool VR arcade. And pushing the boundaries of what’s possible is always important, so I hope you can find a good way to do local VR. That would be a pretty great selling point.

      • GodMk2

        Ps its easy to add powersockets… but try getting 3x USB3 aruound and to the otherside of the room! Especially when you mobo already has Keyboard, mouse, A-D injector box, HD webcam, and head set plugged in! No for me… 1x sensor will do. Already had Oculus complaining the USB3 on my old mobo wasnt correct 🙁

    • Matthew White

      Multiplayer VR is not happening anytime soon. This is a non-issue.

      • Lukimator

        No, the thing is it will NEVER happen with 2 players in the same room unless you are using some kind of treadmill, in which case the tracking system doesn’t matter a lot really

        • Matthew White

          I could see in the future with some new kind of tracking, multiple people playing a game in VR on something like a football field or something. You’d have to use backpack PCs or some kind of wireless headset, but it would be awesome.

          • Lukimator

            Inside your house you mean? I don’t see it. Most people don’t have the room for that which means developers won’t bother trying

            Regular people will use 2 different rooms for VR if they want that

        • GodMk2

          Treadmills are not needed. Expensive waste of money that limits your position. Combining controlles for long distance walking and actual movement for minor adjustment works fine in onward and Raw Data.

          • VR Zone BKK

            Imagine what can be achieved once we have the wireless kit for the Vive, acutally I’m thinking to build an HPC Server with KVMs to handle mutltiple HMDs for multiplayer games but not only, I’m just waiting on the wireless specs of the announced kit.

          • Lukimator

            Treadmills in their CURRENT form are not needed. Controller locomotion is never going to be mainstream because the % of people who get sick from it and are unwilling to adapt is too high.

            I can’t see roomscale still being a thing in 10 years

      • GodMk2

        They already exist. Check your stem library. Rec room. Raw data. Onward to name my favourites and more being added all the time.

        • Matthew White

          Oh you play those in the same room with other people? Interesting, you would think you would run in to each other a lot.

          • GodMk2

            Most people play at home online. But im running a vrcade so must have titles as getting in with someone you know is even more fun. You dont actually cross play areas… just adjacent to each other. Vive has mic built in so you can hear each other in the headset 😉 I forgot to include hoverjunkers in the list which does allow play space sharing! Not tried it yet.

      • Merlin

        I do 2x Vive multiplayer in the same room on a weekly basis. It’s very very fun playing Raw Data, HordeZ, Bomb U, VR Disc Golf, Onward, etc. with someone else in the same room. We just shut off mic transmit because the voice chatter echoes. But it’s a lot of fun.

    • Michael Griffin

      You’re completely and totally wrong. You can have multiple people use the same cameras. The Rift light emitters pulse in a pattern specific to each individual headset. So one Rift emmits a pulse of say long short long and another emits a pulse of short long short. By doing this the software can tell the devices apart. Also the patterns are far more complex and allows for technically thousands of different patterns.

      • GodMk2

        Well 1st I was asking a question…so I cant be wrong. I was asking how is it done. 2nd… im aware the Rift HMD does the IR emitting as Ive seen IR photos of it with the dots glowing. My question is how many tracking sensors do I need to set up to get multiplayer working? 3 per PC?. So a 4 player set up would need 12 in a room? Vive reverses the IR and the lighthhouses emit the IR. So only 2 are needed per room as long as you can mount them high enough to avoid occlusion. I’m currently using 2 Rifts for seated / standing only with the 1 sensor each. But it looks like roomscale needs a complete redesign. Or just stick with Vives for those. I’ll be using 4 in 1 room. Edit.. what you didnt explain is how do multiple people use the same cameras.. does 1 pc do the tracking and send the tracking data across a network? The rift usb cables all go into 1 pc

      • Nicholas

        You’d need a seriously beefy rig to power two HMDs at the same time with a single set of cameras. Two seperate Rift rigs would need two seperate sets of cameras.

        • Michael Griffin

          I have 2 gpu’s in my system. So for me it would be no big deal to power both HMD. I am also running a pretty beefy CPU with 16gb ram and multiple SSD’s

  • bschuler

    OK.. fights over, the bell has rung. Finally! I’ve been saying it from day 1, Why would anyone who wants room scale, go out and buy a HMD that just doesn’t support it? The Rift is very cool for what it is, don’t get me wrong. Many people will love it. I am not knocking the Rift at all. But there were many people who I just never understood, who went out and bought the Rift and then kept dreaming that they bought something that they clearly did not buy, a HMD that will do great room scale.It’s like buying a car, hoping one day it will fly. It just made no sense to me. So to some, believe it or not, this slightly smaller room size will be a disappointment and shock to them… well to those people, I say get over it. Your just lucky it does any room scale.

    • Matthew White

      It’ll do room scale fine.

      • Paulo

        Lol at these fanboys. “Fights over boys!”. Mine wins!

  • xxHanoverxx

    Whats the point of VR if you still have to worry about boundaries?

    • Mario-Galouzeau de Bocsa

      Sky is the limit. Or the walls. Depends where you live.

    • Doctor Bambi

      … So neither headset then?

  • slikk66

    Also, vive is still 699 in some places after black friday/cyber monday

  • Michael Griffin

    This article is just inflammatory. I own a rift and with one camera I can get 16 feet away and still have tracking. If I had to cameras they could be 32 feet apart. Even if I kept them 16 feet apart that would give me a play area 128 ft^2 or a side length of 11.3 feet long. The average square area of Vive setups on steam is 94.3 ft^2. That leaves over 30 square feet extra in the Rifts capabilities in the distances I have tested.

    • DoubleD

      Actually, the Vive is capable of doing double of what they put on the box.
      I saw a video from the guys who made Hoover Junkers where they tested the limits of the tracking.
      They were able to go as far as 12m diagonal (about 40ft) since each lighthouse can produce a 6m radius of tracking.
      They were riding around on a scooter with a headset.

      • Michael Griffin

        I know what the vive is capable of I’ve seen the video and own a vive. That video does nothing for 99 percent of people. Most people have normal sized house’s and have normal dozed rooms. Having a 40 for diagonal is cool but completely impractical.

  • bunnyfreakz

    Even if Oculus Touch and Vive are comparable, Vive overall package still cheaper. You don’t need to become fanboy to know which a better option. Also indie and game dev already pumping out contents to steam meanwhile Oculus still meddling around with their overpriced exclusive store.

    • DoubleD

      But the quality of games on the Rift Store is higher. They are actual full games.
      You should check it out some time.
      Lucky’s Tale is free for example.

      It is a good thing something like Revive exists.

  • OkinKun

    So what? It is absolutely pointless to bring this up, as if it’s some kind of benefit of Vive’s setup. Most users will NEVER notice the Vive’s extra space ability, as the vast majority of potential VR owners do NOT have that kind of space available. Most people don’t even have what the Rift can do, available to devote to a VR space. I can only manage about 2/3rds of that space open for VR in my room.
    This only benefits people who turn basements/garages into VR spaces, or VR Arcades.
    And while we’re at it.. What’s more noticeable for consumer VR immersion, more than 8ft room-scale, or small hand-controllers really good hand-presence and finger-tracking? I think consumers will notice the hand presence right in front of them, more than an extra 3 feet or whatever.
    BTW, those 2 front cameras in your diagrams, are actually able to see a LOT wider, than your drawn boxes would suggest. It’s more like 8×12. lol

    • Nicholas

      When space is a premium (which for many people it is), you want to cover the maximum area available to you. The Rift cameras may have a relatively wide fov horizontally, it’s much narrower on the vertical. Which means they have to be further back from the viewable play volume if you don’t want your controllers being clipped when you’re shooting above your head or crouching down. This is why you see most Touch videos are of people dancing in front of their monitors, not proper room-scale.

      Hand presence? Finger tracking? Marketing nonsense.

      • OkinKun

        Shows you haven’t tried it. It’s not nonsense. Hand presence, having your hands feel correct in VR, leads to a greater sense of actually being there. It’s a huge immersion booster, and it deserves it’s own term, such as hand-presence. And finger-tracking should go without explaination, Vive can’t, Touch can, that’s a big difference for gameplay.
        And people don’t need to pay for excess features they’ll never use, and most people simply do NOT have more than 10×10 feet for VR space, and the Rift does just fine with that IMO.
        There are tons of Touch videos already, showing people walking all around a 10×10 space, crouching and jumping, no tracking problems. The camera’s vertical FOV isn’t that bad either, with just 1 Rift camera, I can track my whole room, and crawl on the floor all the way up to the camera.
        You’re making up problems that don’t exist when you actually try this stuff.

        • Nicholas

          I hate to break this to you, but there are plenty of games on the Vive that have “hand presence”. Perhaps you should try them. Oh, wait, you don’t have a Vive. Finger tracking is Oculus marketing for button state. Already been done on a few Vive games (minus the capacitive feature of Touch…next revision of the HTC controllers have this).

          • OkinKun

            Vive can only approximate hand-presence, by guessing where your hand is, and placing a rough estimate in the same space. Most vive games don’t do that, they show the wands/tools your holding instead. If the hands don’t line up with your real hands, it makes presence worse. And the Vive wands unfortunately allow people to hold them all kinds of different ways, making it hard for developers to predict hands right.
            As a developer, I’ve used BOTH systems already. Thus why I’m making this argument, that Touch is a better controller, I’ve felt it.
            Finger tracking is NOT marketing, and not just button-state. Each button has capacitive sensors that detect on/off and even Near states, which allows for each finger to have like 3 pose-states. This does wonders for tricking your brain, making you feel like they are your real hands. Vive can’t do anything like this, it’s almost as good as LeapMotion or a finger-glove. It completely changes whats possible, and how far your hands go into VR.
            Touch has better hand-presence, because the shape of the controllers is designed to ergonomically fit snugly into the palm of your hand, in a resting state, and in a predictable way for everyone holding it. They’re designed to ensure they can only be held in a predictable pose, thus allowing developers to align the virtual hands up with your real hands much better.
            All these things work off each other, and you quickly forget your even holding Touch at all, it vanishes and you feel like using your actual hands sometimes.

          • Nicholas

            Wow, I guess games like Onward, Raw Data, Chair in a Room have nooooo hand presence or gestures. None at all. Riiiiight.
            And I’ve checked the Oculus SDK, BTW: your fabled finger tracking has only one additional state to a Vive button, and that’s just touching it. There’s no “near” state or any technology on the controller to determine such a thing – it’s not Leap Motion.

          • OkinKun

            There’s a BIG difference between gestures that are activated by a menu or button, and gestures that you perform with your ACTUAL fingers. That should be obvious, it’s far more immersive to see your virtual fingers move with your real fingers. Simulated gestures don’t compare.
            OH? And I guess that’s why those games are all updating for proper Touch support and better hand-models? Games like Onward on Vive had an approximation and simulated gestures and hand-position, as good as the developer could. It works fine, but it’s not the same as Touch, and that’s why they’re updating. The Touch version of these games will be better than the Vive version. ;P
            I only repeated what another developer told me bout their Touch support: Capacitive sensors are capable of detecting slightly-off and off-completely, that might be where that ‘near’ term came from. I’ve seen a demo where they could move their fingers in several different poses, simply by moving their real finger.

  • KimplE

    There sure are fanboys around here… should i pick a side?

    • Trooper

      I have picked a side. I chose the ones who can see both headsets as wonderful pieces of tech that are there to be enjoyed not fought over.

      • KimplE

        yeah, you have chosen the best side, and i think this gen of headset battle is just stupid. THEY ARE FIRST GEN HEADSET PEOPLE… both has lot things to improve. and that will be the job of upcoming generations of VR.

      • DoubleD

        We are like the gray jedis.

        I want this tech to succeed, not hope to have chosen the best brand.
        I am even rooting for PSVR to get a great lineup and get more people into VR.

        • Trooper

          I also try and promote as much as possible but sometimes it is very difficult when certain people are too busy trying to create childish “my headset is better than yours” arguments. Even my 12 yr old son has enough sense to recognise pro’s and con’s for a lot of tech equipment, he is far more intelligent than some of the people who frequent these forums that is for sure.

          But back on topic in a perfect world every HMD would be able to use any software, I personally would love to see some of the PSVR titles migrate over to PC and vice versa.

    • Ferret Bomb

      Seriously. You make a comment about trying out both and post your observations about the pros/cons of each, and you get fanboys yelling about how you’re lying/’spreading misinformation’. Holy hell.

  • Yet but Oculus Touch blows the Vive Wands out of the water. So i’d gladly sacrifice a meter of tracking space

  • Nicholas

    All I hear from bitter Rifters is “Touch is soooo coooool, it’s going to blow Vive out the water!”. You then tell them the actual technical limitations of the Rift’s tracking, and they then come back with “no-one has a room bigger than 1 sq.m. Rift still wins”. Room-scale? “The Rift can have 20 cameras therefore it must be better. Look at RealityCheckVR’s videos”. Sad really. And then you look at the actual Touch games and they’re all laughable 180-degree affairs. “Oh, that’s not Oculus, that’s the dev’s fault”. Seriously? Give it a rest.

    • Get Schwifty!

      It wouldn’t be such a problem if it weren’t for the constant idiotic Vive fanboys dropping attack comments into any discussion surrounding Oculus. The reality is the controllers are pretty sweet, the tracking is definitely good enough and the camera-sensors have enough tracking volume to satisfy most people. You do realize people can play room scale Vive games with Touch right? Just saying, it’s about more than just the Touch-focused games Oculus Home is putting out… the other sad reality is how some VIve owners insist that EVERYTHING about the Vive is superior when a lot comes down to personal preference.

  • We all know that Oculus had to follow Vive about room-scaling and I guess this is the best compromise they have been able to make. But for controller ergonomics, they win now. Every headset has its peculiarities

    • Nicholas

      Oculus really should have ditched the CV1 and gone with a CV2 that had proper tracking and included the ergonomic controllers. As it stands, they’re in an uncomfortable halfway house, and are actually now holding back VR developments IMO.

  • Mike

    I have the rift and my one camera covers me over more than a 1.5m space I’m assuming other users have too?

    I have a 2.2 x 2.2 square to play in and I have reached the wall before it has lost tracking, although tracking does suffer when my back is to the camera. These diagrams do not ring true to what I have experienced.

    • Nicholas

      Tracking just the headset needs only a single camera. Tracking the controllers needs more than one since your body can occlude them.
      The accuracy drops off exponentially with distance. And the camera’s limited vertical fov means you have to give up some play area near the camera where it can’t see you.